Lee Elder

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Posts by Lee Elder

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  78

  I believe that the greater percentage of JWs-You Will Not Be Able to Help, no Matter What Facts You Show Them.

  by John Aquila in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  so i ran into this brother whom ive known for a while and the conversation led into me being invited to come back to the kingdom hall.

  we talked for about an hour during which time i explained to him 607 being the wrong date and a lot of other stuff including the child abuse cases in australia.

  but what i wanted to relate was the last few minutes of our conversation.

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  Lee Elder

  Some people like living in the Matrix, tasting the make believe steak and other goodies. The cold, hard truth is that your friend has about a 65% probability of his children leaving for the world by the time they reach adulthood. Then his perfect JW family will be in complete turmoil - particularly if they are baptized. He also runs the risk of being a part of the administration of the WTS abusive policies that wreck lives and cause premature death. So while its possible that his fairy tale life will remain intact, the odds are against it. No free lunches in life. He's making his bed - he will sleep in it - just like the rest of us.
  
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  49

  GEOFFREY JACKSON THE PERSONABLE FACE OF JW.ORG...BUT IT AIN'T OVER YET BUDDY

  by steve2 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  since geoffrey jackson's appearance before the australian royal commission on friday there has for some been an expressed feeling of anticlimax.

  it is as though he was given too much latitude to preach, to claim ignorance and to skirt questions.

  more to the point, as much as i myself thought i would never have expected to say this, gj actually came across as likeable and - don't throttle me please!

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  Lee Elder

  This is a process in my view. They have created a highly valuable record for both criminal and civil proceedings in the months and years to come. I rather doubt we have seen the end of this :-)
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  28

  The Royal Commission and Watchtower - A game changer

  by Hidden-Window in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i had finished watching all the videos on the royal commission's investigation of jehovah's witnesses (yes, i know more videos are being released).

  i am still processing the information of everything that has emerged.

  i do not plan to cover it all here, but i would like to point out that it is patently obvious that some of the wt representatives provided misleading information.

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  Lee Elder

  I can remember a ministerial servant back in the mid 90's standing up near the front of the hall with his son who was acting up and stomping done the middle of th aisle to take his son outside. He was removing his belt to beat the child as he was walking for everyone to see.

  At the next visit he was recommended as an elder. I was the only one who objected. I am sure this is the kind of thing that varies depending on time and local custom but it was common and it was accepted.

  The city overseer once cautioned the congregation about spanking their children in the parking lot for fear that a neighbor would call child protective services. Better to do it in your car!
  
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  39

  Billy's comments to the RC #1 - "We always require at least two witnesses... except for when we don't."

  by Billy the Ex-Bethelite in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  i'm still trying to catch up on the rc broadcast posted to youtube, and i haven't been able to keep up with everything discussed here about it.

  however, there have been a few points that i wish i could submit.

  repeatedly it has been stated that unless there is a confession, jcs can only act on testimony if it is corroborated by two or more witnesses to the wrongdoing.

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  Lee Elder

  I sent this to the Royal Commission which they acknowledged:

  Their (WTS) interpretation of scripture to support their "two witness rule" seems quite convenient, doesn't it? I think its worth noting that in cases where the victim goes on their own to the police and the perpetrator is convicted, they will then be disfellowshiped from the congregation - regardless of whether or not there was two witnesses. Why are they willing to abandon their scriptural policy in this circumstance? In my experience, the saving of face and organizational prestige are primary motivators in policy formation. It is the appearance of being "clean or holy" that drives policy and decision making in far too many instances. What is needed is less "whitewashing" and more action to protect children. That and a recognition that police have the tools and training to actually investigate suspected crimes, not JW elders. It is really quite appalling. If a serious crime were to be committed at a JW facility, say at a Kingdom Hall, there is no doubt that the police would be called to investigate. They simply refuse to implement policy that would require investigation by the police when accusations of child abuse arise. Clearly, they don’t see child abuse as the serious crime it truly is. Hopefully, the commission will send a very strong and clear message that this won’t be tolerated.
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  53

  Just wrote my DA letter....

  by dubstepped in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my wife and i planned on fading but the elders now want a shepherding call and we are just done.

  i know that many play the game to try to stay in, but i'm not a game player and neither is my wife.

  our families already shun us because we reached out to a disfellowshipped family member.

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  Lee Elder

  You don't have to play their game, but if you do - play it well as Marvin suggests.
  
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  36

  Going to a bad place when i die

  by 060702015 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i've thought and said too much to ever gain jehovahs forgiveness and love if i want to be a christian again.

  i made a topic on my unforgivable sin and blaspemy of the holy spirit.. i feel saddness everyday having no relationship with god, no religion and fear of the afterlife.

  even when i was kid i feared death and the end of the world.

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  Lee Elder

  Try reading this article:

  http://www.babcp.com/Review/RTS-Trauma-from-Leaving-Religion.aspx
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  58

  Governing body deceiving members on purpose?

  by wwjdnwt in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i was born into this religion.

  i was a jw for well over 30 years.

  i did much research before i had internet, i compared bibles and prayed deeply to help me to know if this was the truth.

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  Lee Elder

  The expression Ray Franz coined was "victims of victims". Individuals who have a "crisis of conscience" find themselves in a very precarious spot. I stayed for a few years as a "reformer" but eventually it becomes too heavy of a burden. I would guess that most members sincerely believe their own malarkey.
  
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  45

  Governing Body, painted in a corner, now what?

  by Wasanelder Once in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  the governing body have painted themselves in a corner, so to speak.

  if they acknowledge their response to abuse claims was insensitive, unloving and inadequate they are denying the belief that "god's way" is best and risk losing abuse cases.

  if they stick with it and say it is "god's way according to the bible" they will be seen as cult leaders and risk losing abuse cases.

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  Lee Elder

  I think its a bombshell. There is going to be immediate carnage in terms of people leaving, withdrawing financial support and possibly criminal charges for destroying evidence related to a felony - possibly multiple counts. There is also going to be fallout - making it more difficult to recruit new members. The organization has had years of brain drain and reminds me of a old boxer who has taken too many punches.
  
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  6

  This misquote makes my blood boil! (Excuse the pun)

  by ILoveTTATT2 in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  this absolutely upsets me!they always keep doing this garbage, putting people into harm's way by not telling them the whole information!and plus, any blood info from australia is likely biased... the two jw's they hired to manage blood transfusions in australia are doing an excellent job at doing propaganda.

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  Lee Elder

  They would like to Jehovah's Witnesses to believe that science fully supports the WTS policy, and they selectively go about sharing only the parts that "tickle their ears".
  
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  16

  Synthetic Blood in 2 Years? How Will the GB Shoot This Down?

  by DarioKehl in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  interesting read.

  if they already allow "fractions," there's no way they can ban this.. here:www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/health-news/nhs-to-give-volunteers-synthetic-blood-made-in-a-laboratory-within-two-years-10343279.html.

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  Lee Elder

  We would welcome that development. That said, however, it would require a substantial reform of the current policy which forbids the use of red cells.